Does the performance-driven nature of our culture extend to aging? Do you feel pressure to age competitively with others, in any particular way? An open thread...
What a great question. I do think among some quarters the competition is Who can look youngest the longest? And in other quarters it's Who can look best while old? And then there's Who can look oldest while not caring the most? I think we generate the competition to take our minds off the fact that we're all going to wind up dead.
I hate the trend of older women in swimsuits — Martha Steward on the cover of Sports Illustrated, Dolly as a Dallas Cowboy cheerleader. On one level, great, you go girl. On another level, you can never be more than a body, you must still be thin and pretty even at a revered age. I know that nobody is putting a gun to their head, but it makes me feel like I’m thirteen again and not quite measuring up to these unrealistic body standards. Jane Seymour who at 65 posed nude for Playboy, said that she hoped her shoot would be “inspirational” to older women. I, for one, was not inspired at all, in fact, it just made me wonder why she’d need to prove herself in this way. I say they are leaning into destructive social and cultural mores. “Girls” as side-pieces to the sport — and Playboy, just yuck. (to me! My adult daughters completely disagree.)
This is a super thought-provoking question! The thing I find tiresome is that most celebrities who are "aging so well" can afford to spend thousands on cosmetic procedures (who amongst we mortals has not lifted their cheeks up in the mirror, just to see?) Plus, they have staff to prep mango smoothies for them and personal trainers at the gym. Knowing these facts intellectually, why does the average woman still think it's possible/appropriate to "compete" with all that? That said, even though I am doing my best to maintain what I can, I do still feel shame for looking older - it's a kind of sadness, like my (last) chance to be even remotely attractive is closing in on me. I then give myself a fierce pep talk about being shallow and count my (considerable) blessings but it's tiresome to deal with and always leaves me another kind of corrosive shame for even caring.
I'm 56 and I have a group of on-line friends around the country (we came together on an attachment parenting board nearly 30 years ago). We are all roughly the same age, crashing around in menopause, caring for elderly parents while launching young adult children. This is a pretty common topic of discussion and one that gets handled gingerly. Some of us are discussing expensive skin cremes and minor surgeries and worrying about thickening middles and others of us are saddened to see that that's still a concern for so many. I was in the sad camp and realized it's a position of privilege. I feel like I hit that sweet spot of attractiveness--I was always "pretty" enough to not worry overmuch about my looks, but not so pretty that it's what I thought made my value. Never thin, but also not fat, bouncing around a 10 lb range (pregnancy aside) without crazy dieting. I have had the same loving partner since I was in my early 20s. So I never *really* felt like I was in the competition in the first place. I've relished the invisibility to Other Men that comes with age and indifference. In my job at a public library, the old dudes flirt with the women that Put in the Effort, giving me not a glance, and I am delighted.
Pet peeve: ads/articles featuring some slender older woman with a "beauty at any age" when clearly this woman has been beautiful at EVERY age. It's not like she had a sudden glow-up at 75. Leave us alone, let us tend to our moss gardens and cast our spells in peace. It doesn't make me feel like I have to compete, but it makes me angry that it's prodding other women who honestly could use a rest.
This is a great question, indeed. At 65 I look back to my 40s and 50s and see someone who was highly competitive in my professional life and the sports I practiced but only with myself. Take on a more difficult job, Mimi; bike that crazy mountain, and such. Life has changed for me in that sense. I still want to have new experiences but am content to walk the same beach or look at the night sky which to me are constantly changing. As for looks, I keep fit because if I don't exercise my body, it fails me; I eat moderately for the same reason. My mother never dyed her hair and after 40 neither have I. My wrinkles and sun spots and sagging this and that are easy to live with on some days, on others I quietly lament. When I am feeling the latter, there's not much to do but take a walk, meet a friend, talk to the cat or whatever. Tomorrow's another day..... I hope.
Yes, there is definitely a competition to age gracefully. I resent that. I'm doing the best I can with what I have and to say that I'm a failure at aging because I have health issues is insulting and dismissive of my life.
Very interesting topic. How often do we look at a photo of a celebrity and say "she looks great!" Or conversely, "she hasn't aged well". When people tell me I look young for my age, I admit that I like that. But I am even happier when they say "your attitude is much younger than 83" I am a lot happier. I think they are telling me that I still have curiosity, a sense of adventure and a desire to interact with the owrld outside my own small bubble of comfort.
Leave it to America, we can turn anything into a competition!
For me, aging and how I want to, I’m 69, is best represented by something that happened last year. I was in a waiting room at a local clinic waiting to be taken back for an ultrasound. A young woman walked out, called “Susan” so I stood and walked over to her. She looked puzzled, asked other identifying questions like last name and dob. When we got to the room she turned to me and said you must be wondering why I was so strange when you walked over after I called your name. She said, it’s because I didn’t think you could possibly be 68. And this is the part that stuck with me; she said it isn’t how you look although you don’t look 68 it’s how you move, how easily you stood up, how quickly you walked over, your posture, and how you carry yourself. I work hard to keep my body moving as easily as possible so I was grateful for the feedback. I like that definition of “youthful”.
I skimmed the comments because I wanted to see how many men were speaking. Out of the 54 comments posted at skim-time only four were from men. Competition to "age well" is very much alive and stuffed into the female psyche on a daily basis. And it's very much about how we LOOK. Some women rebel and some embrace these cultural pushes. The point is that women are a target. These pressures have existed for us since birth and are simply redefined as we age. Social media serves as yet another outlet for defending our aging choices. Naturally we seek out the messages that we most align with for further validation. Finally, I have to wonder....would this question have been posed to you, Sari, if you identified as a man?
There is a sense that to age well means not to age at all, to continue one’s life as it has always been despite the changes that age brings. You “have to” remain physically vigorous, muscles well-toned, skin radiant, spirit ever-adventurous. If you accept changes—not walking so far, sleeping later, acknowledging that travel has been more difficult, conceding that not every one of life’s dreams may now be possible—you’re accused of “giving up.” Or worse “letting” yourself get old, as though it were a choice, and a bad one.
When there’s money to be made, someone will be marketing an “idea,” or a product to make you dissatisfied with where you’re at naturally!! So yes there’s pressure, but I don’t want to focus totally on that aspect of the modern grandma. Let’s face it, the archetypal grandma is gone … and I for one miss her … and our society needs her!! She’s grey, slightly plump, wise and just a couple miles away. She’s got family pictures on the wall, homemade cookies in the cookie jar, and a couple bucks in her purse that she slips to her grandkids when they want some longed for item.
Now grandma is busy with her Pilates class, on a dating site, and living in another state with a roommate. It’s a disconnected world and young children especially could use a soft-breasted lady to snuggle into and feel all is right in grandma’s lap!
I think our culture is set up to make women feel not enough, period. Your two examples are evidence of this. If you're doing things to look younger, you're not aging gracefully. If you're not doing things to look or feel younger then you're not taking care of yourself or taking pride in yourself. I'm sure we can come up with a million similar examples for women at any age (the monologue from America Ferrera in Barbie comes to mind.) In general, I think making people not feel satsifed with who they are and "enough", is big business. That's what is behind this facade of "competition". It is also true to say this also makes this very discussion a discussion of privilege. The experience of the low income aging population is very different from those of us debating hair color.
I put personal pressure on myself to stay as fit as possible but the rest of it I leave to the forces of nature. I am well beyond vanity. Functioning from a perspective of ego or fear is no longer a driving force in my life - what a relief.
I'm personally not in any sort of competition but it's interesting that one exists in our culture. I'm wondering though if it's not just another part of this breakdown that's happened over the last 100 years in our relationship with the natural world. Its almost like dying shouldn't happen, which of course is ridiculous. It's the only thing we can be absolutely sure of. With science and technology, I think is humans have allowed some silly ideas to take root. These ideas convince us we have more agency than we really do. Some diseases have been cured and average lifespans increased but we are living longer than we are designed to. The body hasn't evolved as fast as our technology. I'm very interested in this disconnect between our technology driven world and our species long history as a mammal. 100 years isn't enough time to fully integrate the massive changes that have happened. And so we try to over ride evolution with everything we've got.
Yes. It could be the simple fact that aging and menopause has now been monetized so there is a need for never ending content. As I navigate the next chapter, some of the content is helpful and some of it is harmful, as is to be expected. I got tired of reading all the articles about all the people who were finding and pursuing their passion as they got older and the dreaded “finding my purpose” articles. They just made me feel more lost. I’m glad the new aging industry exists because it’s important, but it does fall victim to the same bullshit we’ve been putting up with forever.
I love your distillation of purpose: “the many joys and sorrows of passing through time in a human body.” Age has been good to me so far. At 74, I feel no pressure to emulate Jane Fonda, but that’s because I’m lucky to be slim and still able to wear a strappy sundress without worrying about my upper arms. The luckiest break is my health—no chronic problems except osteoarthritis. Many of my friends have been unlucky, and quite a few didn’t live to be 60. For me losing people is the hardest part of aging. The pain is new every time and never entirely fades, nor should it. The prospect of my death doesn’t trouble me. What troubles me is loved ones dying. I’ll sit down with an old (in both senses) friend and wonder which of us will be first to go. I’ve learned not to mention this. It’s a conversation killer.
What a great question. I do think among some quarters the competition is Who can look youngest the longest? And in other quarters it's Who can look best while old? And then there's Who can look oldest while not caring the most? I think we generate the competition to take our minds off the fact that we're all going to wind up dead.
I hate the trend of older women in swimsuits — Martha Steward on the cover of Sports Illustrated, Dolly as a Dallas Cowboy cheerleader. On one level, great, you go girl. On another level, you can never be more than a body, you must still be thin and pretty even at a revered age. I know that nobody is putting a gun to their head, but it makes me feel like I’m thirteen again and not quite measuring up to these unrealistic body standards. Jane Seymour who at 65 posed nude for Playboy, said that she hoped her shoot would be “inspirational” to older women. I, for one, was not inspired at all, in fact, it just made me wonder why she’d need to prove herself in this way. I say they are leaning into destructive social and cultural mores. “Girls” as side-pieces to the sport — and Playboy, just yuck. (to me! My adult daughters completely disagree.)
This is a super thought-provoking question! The thing I find tiresome is that most celebrities who are "aging so well" can afford to spend thousands on cosmetic procedures (who amongst we mortals has not lifted their cheeks up in the mirror, just to see?) Plus, they have staff to prep mango smoothies for them and personal trainers at the gym. Knowing these facts intellectually, why does the average woman still think it's possible/appropriate to "compete" with all that? That said, even though I am doing my best to maintain what I can, I do still feel shame for looking older - it's a kind of sadness, like my (last) chance to be even remotely attractive is closing in on me. I then give myself a fierce pep talk about being shallow and count my (considerable) blessings but it's tiresome to deal with and always leaves me another kind of corrosive shame for even caring.
I'm 56 and I have a group of on-line friends around the country (we came together on an attachment parenting board nearly 30 years ago). We are all roughly the same age, crashing around in menopause, caring for elderly parents while launching young adult children. This is a pretty common topic of discussion and one that gets handled gingerly. Some of us are discussing expensive skin cremes and minor surgeries and worrying about thickening middles and others of us are saddened to see that that's still a concern for so many. I was in the sad camp and realized it's a position of privilege. I feel like I hit that sweet spot of attractiveness--I was always "pretty" enough to not worry overmuch about my looks, but not so pretty that it's what I thought made my value. Never thin, but also not fat, bouncing around a 10 lb range (pregnancy aside) without crazy dieting. I have had the same loving partner since I was in my early 20s. So I never *really* felt like I was in the competition in the first place. I've relished the invisibility to Other Men that comes with age and indifference. In my job at a public library, the old dudes flirt with the women that Put in the Effort, giving me not a glance, and I am delighted.
Pet peeve: ads/articles featuring some slender older woman with a "beauty at any age" when clearly this woman has been beautiful at EVERY age. It's not like she had a sudden glow-up at 75. Leave us alone, let us tend to our moss gardens and cast our spells in peace. It doesn't make me feel like I have to compete, but it makes me angry that it's prodding other women who honestly could use a rest.
This is a great question, indeed. At 65 I look back to my 40s and 50s and see someone who was highly competitive in my professional life and the sports I practiced but only with myself. Take on a more difficult job, Mimi; bike that crazy mountain, and such. Life has changed for me in that sense. I still want to have new experiences but am content to walk the same beach or look at the night sky which to me are constantly changing. As for looks, I keep fit because if I don't exercise my body, it fails me; I eat moderately for the same reason. My mother never dyed her hair and after 40 neither have I. My wrinkles and sun spots and sagging this and that are easy to live with on some days, on others I quietly lament. When I am feeling the latter, there's not much to do but take a walk, meet a friend, talk to the cat or whatever. Tomorrow's another day..... I hope.
Yes, there is definitely a competition to age gracefully. I resent that. I'm doing the best I can with what I have and to say that I'm a failure at aging because I have health issues is insulting and dismissive of my life.
Very interesting topic. How often do we look at a photo of a celebrity and say "she looks great!" Or conversely, "she hasn't aged well". When people tell me I look young for my age, I admit that I like that. But I am even happier when they say "your attitude is much younger than 83" I am a lot happier. I think they are telling me that I still have curiosity, a sense of adventure and a desire to interact with the owrld outside my own small bubble of comfort.
Leave it to America, we can turn anything into a competition!
For me, aging and how I want to, I’m 69, is best represented by something that happened last year. I was in a waiting room at a local clinic waiting to be taken back for an ultrasound. A young woman walked out, called “Susan” so I stood and walked over to her. She looked puzzled, asked other identifying questions like last name and dob. When we got to the room she turned to me and said you must be wondering why I was so strange when you walked over after I called your name. She said, it’s because I didn’t think you could possibly be 68. And this is the part that stuck with me; she said it isn’t how you look although you don’t look 68 it’s how you move, how easily you stood up, how quickly you walked over, your posture, and how you carry yourself. I work hard to keep my body moving as easily as possible so I was grateful for the feedback. I like that definition of “youthful”.
I skimmed the comments because I wanted to see how many men were speaking. Out of the 54 comments posted at skim-time only four were from men. Competition to "age well" is very much alive and stuffed into the female psyche on a daily basis. And it's very much about how we LOOK. Some women rebel and some embrace these cultural pushes. The point is that women are a target. These pressures have existed for us since birth and are simply redefined as we age. Social media serves as yet another outlet for defending our aging choices. Naturally we seek out the messages that we most align with for further validation. Finally, I have to wonder....would this question have been posed to you, Sari, if you identified as a man?
There is a sense that to age well means not to age at all, to continue one’s life as it has always been despite the changes that age brings. You “have to” remain physically vigorous, muscles well-toned, skin radiant, spirit ever-adventurous. If you accept changes—not walking so far, sleeping later, acknowledging that travel has been more difficult, conceding that not every one of life’s dreams may now be possible—you’re accused of “giving up.” Or worse “letting” yourself get old, as though it were a choice, and a bad one.
When there’s money to be made, someone will be marketing an “idea,” or a product to make you dissatisfied with where you’re at naturally!! So yes there’s pressure, but I don’t want to focus totally on that aspect of the modern grandma. Let’s face it, the archetypal grandma is gone … and I for one miss her … and our society needs her!! She’s grey, slightly plump, wise and just a couple miles away. She’s got family pictures on the wall, homemade cookies in the cookie jar, and a couple bucks in her purse that she slips to her grandkids when they want some longed for item.
Now grandma is busy with her Pilates class, on a dating site, and living in another state with a roommate. It’s a disconnected world and young children especially could use a soft-breasted lady to snuggle into and feel all is right in grandma’s lap!
I think our culture is set up to make women feel not enough, period. Your two examples are evidence of this. If you're doing things to look younger, you're not aging gracefully. If you're not doing things to look or feel younger then you're not taking care of yourself or taking pride in yourself. I'm sure we can come up with a million similar examples for women at any age (the monologue from America Ferrera in Barbie comes to mind.) In general, I think making people not feel satsifed with who they are and "enough", is big business. That's what is behind this facade of "competition". It is also true to say this also makes this very discussion a discussion of privilege. The experience of the low income aging population is very different from those of us debating hair color.
I put personal pressure on myself to stay as fit as possible but the rest of it I leave to the forces of nature. I am well beyond vanity. Functioning from a perspective of ego or fear is no longer a driving force in my life - what a relief.
I'm personally not in any sort of competition but it's interesting that one exists in our culture. I'm wondering though if it's not just another part of this breakdown that's happened over the last 100 years in our relationship with the natural world. Its almost like dying shouldn't happen, which of course is ridiculous. It's the only thing we can be absolutely sure of. With science and technology, I think is humans have allowed some silly ideas to take root. These ideas convince us we have more agency than we really do. Some diseases have been cured and average lifespans increased but we are living longer than we are designed to. The body hasn't evolved as fast as our technology. I'm very interested in this disconnect between our technology driven world and our species long history as a mammal. 100 years isn't enough time to fully integrate the massive changes that have happened. And so we try to over ride evolution with everything we've got.
Yes. It could be the simple fact that aging and menopause has now been monetized so there is a need for never ending content. As I navigate the next chapter, some of the content is helpful and some of it is harmful, as is to be expected. I got tired of reading all the articles about all the people who were finding and pursuing their passion as they got older and the dreaded “finding my purpose” articles. They just made me feel more lost. I’m glad the new aging industry exists because it’s important, but it does fall victim to the same bullshit we’ve been putting up with forever.
I love your distillation of purpose: “the many joys and sorrows of passing through time in a human body.” Age has been good to me so far. At 74, I feel no pressure to emulate Jane Fonda, but that’s because I’m lucky to be slim and still able to wear a strappy sundress without worrying about my upper arms. The luckiest break is my health—no chronic problems except osteoarthritis. Many of my friends have been unlucky, and quite a few didn’t live to be 60. For me losing people is the hardest part of aging. The pain is new every time and never entirely fades, nor should it. The prospect of my death doesn’t trouble me. What troubles me is loved ones dying. I’ll sit down with an old (in both senses) friend and wonder which of us will be first to go. I’ve learned not to mention this. It’s a conversation killer.